Guides > Paint > Paint Reaction Values

This is an import of the T2 values. They are Partially correct (for example lead-cabbage does not react, there may be other changes too).

How to figure your paint reaction values and plan a color strategy

Here are the RGB values for the base ingredients:

Note: these RGB values are direct from the T1 guide and are likely to have changed

Ingredient	Short	Red	Green	Blue
Cabbage Juice	cj	128	64	144
Carrots	cr	224	112	32
Clay	cl	128	96	32
Copper	co	64	192	192
Dead Tongue	dt	112	64	64
Earth Light	el	128	240	224
Iron	io	96	48	32
Lead	lo	80	80	96
Red Sand	rs	144	16	24
Silver Powder	si	16	16	32
Toad Skin	ts	48	96	48

Note that these RGB values are different from the ones you will get from measuring them with a color picker. This is because the color swatch on the paint lab window is alpha-channel blended with the background of the window (the marbled tan). You need to correct for this. The best way is to take a 9x9 or 16x16 pixel averaged sample of both the swatch and the background, then apply the following formula for each color component (red, green, blue):

Real = (Measured - Background)/(250/256) + Background

(which is the same as 1.024*Measured - 0.024*Background).

Some, but not all ingredients "react" with each other, and order is important.

So when you want to find your reaction number for Cabbage Juice + Dead tongue, first work out what the expected mix is: (130 + 114) / 2 for red etc...

Then do the mix and sample the color. The difference from expected (so subtract the expected value from the one you actually got) is your reaction value.

(For more info, see: http://www.atitd.net/forum/showthread.php?t=516 )

An alternate method for finding the RGB color is to take a screenshot (Alt-C) of the pigment lab menu and measure length of the RGB color bars in pixels. This can be done using a select tool in most graphics programs, such as Paint Shop Pro. Measuring from the outer border of the color bar seems to work best, then take the result times (255 / total width of outer border) (rounded) to find the actual color value. You may find this more accurate than the alpha-blending method. (Note: This method was suggested by Quizzical).

The following two tables detail which ingredients react (remember it's order dependent too). The size of a reaction will be different between different people, but it always affects the same color for everyone. The tables below show which color is boosted by a reaction (if it's "white", it means all 3 channels (red, green and blue) are affected).

By measuring the exact magnitudes of your reactions for all of the following pairs, you can calculate a recipe (or more than one) for a given paint using one of the tools linked at the bottom of the Painting Guide.

(this information was gathered for Tale2 by LittleCleo? and posted at http://www.atitd.net/forum/showthread.php?t=6126 - verification would be appreciated in case of any mistakes) LittleCleo also wrote a tutorial in T2, tale2:Guides/Paint/Paint_Reaction_Values/Tutorial

See [Paint Reaction Values By Color]? too.

Reaction	Color boosted	Comments
Cabbage Juice + Copper	white
Cabbage Juice + Earth Light	green
Cabbage Juice + Iron	white
Cabbage Juice + Lead	blue	I don't get any reaction. Vinstor
Cabbage Juice + Red Sand	green
Carrots + Lead	white
Carrots + Red Sand	blue
Carrots + Toad Skin	white
Clay + Copper	red
Clay + Earth Light	blue
Clay + Lead	blue
Clay + Silver Powder	blue
Clay + Toad Skin	red
Toad Skin + Carrots	white
Toad Skin + Clay	red
Toad Skin + Copper	white
Toad Skin + Lead	white
Earth Light + Cabbage Juice	green
Earth Light + Clay	blue
Earth Light + Iron	red
Earth Light + Lead	green
Earth Light + Red Sand	red
Red Sand + Cabbage Juice	green
Red Sand + Carrots	blue
Red Sand + Earth Light	red
Red Sand + Silver Powder	red
Lead + Carrots	white
Lead + Clay	blue
Lead + Copper	white
Lead + Earth Light	green
Lead + Iron	blue
Lead + Toad Skin	white
Lead + Silver Powder	green
Silver Powder + Clay	blue
Silver Powder + Copper	green
Silver Powder + Iron	blue
Silver Powder + Lead	green
Silver Powder + Red Sand	red
Iron + Cabbage Juice	white
Iron + Earth Light	red
Iron + Lead	blue
Iron + Silver Powder	blue
Copper + Cabbage Juice	white
Copper + Clay	red
Copper + Lead	white
Copper + Toad Skin	white
Copper + Silver Powder	green

And here are the catalyst reactions:

Reaction	Color boosted
Lime + Carrots	green
Lime + Toad Skin	red
Carrots + Lime	green
Toad Skin + Lime	red
Potash + Cabbage Juice	blue
Potash + Carrots	white
Potash + Earth Light	red
Potash + Toad Skin	red
Potash + Sulfur	green
Cabbage Juice + Potash	blue
Carrots + Potash	white
Earth Light + Potash	red
Toad Skin + Potash	red
Saltpeter + Clay	blue
Saltpeter + Copper	blue
Saltpeter + Iron	white
Saltpeter + Lead	green
Saltpeter + Silver	green
Clay + Saltpeter	blue
Copper + Saltpeter	blue
Iron + Saltpeter	white
Lead + Saltpeter	green
Silver + Saltpeter	green
Sulfur + Clay	green
Sulfur + Copper	white
Sulfur + Earth Light	red
Sulfur + Iron	green
Sulfur + Potash	green
Clay + Sulfur	green
Copper + Sulfur	white
Iron + Sulfur	green
Earth Light + Sulfur	red

Here are the Dead Tongue Reactions (Non-Catalyst)

Reaction	Color boosted
Dead Tongue + Cabbage Juice	blue
Dead Tongue + Carrots	red
Dead Tongue + Copper	blue
Dead Tongue + Iron	blue
Dead Tongue + Lead	green
Dead Tongue + Red Sand	blue
Dead Tongue + Toad Skin	green
Cabbage Juice + Dead Tongue	blue
Carrots + Dead Tongue	red
Copper + Dead Tongue	blue
Iron + Dead Tongue	blue
Lead + Dead Tongue	green
Red Sand + Dead Tongue	blue
Toad Skin + Dead Tongue	green

Here are the Dead Tongue Catalyst Reactions:

Reaction	Color boosted
Dead Tongue + Lime	white
Dead Tongue + Potash	blue
Lime + Dead Tongue	white
Potash + Dead Tongue	blue

---

Discussion

• Hey MJR, I used (and continue to use) antichaos' values for several reasons: 1, most people will be using a color picker to sample and test their reactions, and therefore the values will not only be off by an equal amount on both sides, but the light tan that is used only skew the data by 2 or 3 out of 255, well within a normal error range. 2, although I was peripherally aware of alpha shading, the tolerances of the color bench are high enough that it almost never makes a difference in practice. Do you think there would be value in having both lists available, or is either one fine? -- Gwyr
  • Actually, I found that the error margin was great enough that I had problems trying to get high-tolerance colors, like lawngreen. The error range isn't a problem for easy colors, like cyan or fuschia, but it can be annoying when trying to get snow or navy. The extra work involved in correcting for alpha channel is a one-time thing, and minimal; you can measure the background once, and have a spreadsheet formula do all the math for you. In fact, I've been thinking about a combined reaction values worksheet app and paint lab simulator. -- mjr

• Hey, does it matter whether you are using 16 or 32-bit color? Most games don't use true alpha-blending unless you are in 32-bit color mode... -Mordeus
  • ATITD only works in 32 bit color mode -TheDude
    • I run ATITD in 16-bit color mode all the time. The color values you get from a screenshot will be different depending on what mode (16 or 32) you are running in. -Japto